"The Tree" Hog

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    • #149
      Hank
      Participant

      Since we last were together with the old Forum I have been fortunate enough to have aquired a SCGC OM made from the “The Tree” back and sides with a European Spruce top.
      I have played quite a bit of A/B between it and the 1934 D Braz/ Adi .
      As the OM is the first Hog guitar I have owned or played( in many years) I really find that those who have described Hog as sounding much different than Braz confuse me.
      While there IS a difference in Voice I find the Hog to be very similar in sustain, warmth and clarity to the Old Braz used on the 34.
      What am I missing in my evaluation of the two ? Is “The Tree” just much different than “Regular” Hog ?
      Your Thoughts are most welcome.


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #151
      Matt Hayden
      Participant

      It’s my understanding that wood from the Tree is generally denser and heavier than generic mahogany (swietenia macrophylla, Honduras, or swietenia mahoganii, which is Cuban).

      That would account for a sonic difference, I think – dense woods with a high Q value (low damping of vibration) will tend to sound one way – which is similar to good rosewoods – while woods with a lower Q (higher damping) will tend to sound a little ‘airier,’ which description is usually applied to mahogany and mahogany-like woods.

      A good test would be to play a mahogany OM (made of non-tree mahogany) vs the Tree.

      Based on a purely anecdotal sample (playing the 00-29 made of Tree mahogany vs my own cuban mahogany 00-29), there are differences in sound, with Tree wood sounding a little more low-damping and reflective.   I also think that it’s some of the most beautiful material I’ve ever seen….

      It’d be fun to instrument a series of similar guitars in different woods and collect some quantitative data.

       

      • This reply was modified 2 years, 8 months ago by Matt Hayden.
      • This reply was modified 2 years, 8 months ago by Matt Hayden.
    • #189
      tadol
      Moderator

      One thing to keep in mind is that there are a number of different “figures” one sees in wood from the tree, and I think there have also been a number of high figure or quilted mahogany that is promoted as “Tree” material, although its hard to be 100% positive it is. The different figures have different properties, and all can be challenging to work.

      While any “Tree” wood is good, what probably sets your guitar apart is the expertise appled by the luthiers at SCGC –

    • #229
      guitarhound
      Participant

      I recently had the good fortune of playing a 1935 D-28. I own a 1934 D mahogany. I was expecting a much larger difference in the tone due to the rosewood vs mahogany.

      So, while my 1934D is not made of “the tree”, I tend to agree that the mahogany vs rosewood difference can be more subtle than one would expect. In my humble opinion, I think the voicing of the top is what’s driving most of what you hear.

      Btw Zorro – that OM is gorgeous!

       

    • #252
      Hank
      Participant

      Here our pix of the SCGC OM “The Tree” as requested


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #254
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #255
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #257
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #258
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #260
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #261
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #262
      Hank
      Participant


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #263
      haasome
      Participant

      Wow, that’s a beauty. I thought this one went to athe Music Emporium.


      – Paul –

      • #264
        Hank
        Participant

        this is several years old….It is the 4th guitar made by SCGC from “The Tree”. It is signed by Richard Hoover as apparently
        he was very “Hands On ” with the building of the guitar.
        Richard seems to have overcome his reservation about building from this wood…I noticed the one at the NAMM show and also he was showing off another “set” of the tree to folks at Namm.


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

      • #432
        wespj10
        Participant

        That’s a stunning guitar!  With only a handful of SCGC “The Tree” guitars ever made, that’s quite a catch on the secondary market…  Listening to the two videos of the OMG from the NAMM show, I completely agree that the sound is much closer to Brazilian than most mahogany.  And I’m interested to know whether you were you able to play the new “The Tree” OM at the NAMM show?  If so, was the tone comparable to the tone on yours?  Also, while there is a difference in the pattern of the quilted mahogany, both this older guitar and the one from NAMM look very similar.  Do you remember much about Richard’s comments regarding the two newer sets?  And/or whether there was anything that made the newer sets different than yours?  Thanks in advance.

    • #266
      haasome
      Participant

      Ah, I see. Yes I thought this was the one from the the NAMM show. You a have a special guitar!


      – Paul –

    • #269

      Zorro what about the Spruce top can you tell us?  It has a very aged look to the coloration. Is this a torrified top?

      It is a stunning looking build!

    • #270
      Hank
      Participant

      Chris,
      it is not a “cooked” top.
      I emailed Carolyn about the guitar when I bought it to get an insurance/replacement value. She replied that it is a European spruce with a ‘lite” vintage tint.
      I asked if the spruce was German or Italian and she replied that SCGCs records indicate the term European Spruce. So I don’t know country of origin for the top.
      Besides being a beautiful guitar it is very comfortable in my old hands.


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #284

      Besides being a beautiful guitar it is very comfortable in my old hands.

      Most important.     You have quite a fine quiver of axes my man!

    • #426
      58spdstr
      Participant

      Here are a few photos of my new OMG with a beautiful set of figured mahogany from The Tree and an equally nice bear clawed European spruce top.  Picture are by Andy Cambria at The Music Emporium.  Many of you saw it at NAMM.  It’s light, responsive and very expressive for a brand new guitar.  My first Santa Cruz in quite a while and not my last.  An exceptional instrument.

      • #437
        wespj10
        Participant

        That OMG is beautiful!  The two videos of this guitar sound amazing.  I’m incredibly impressed by the tone that comes from that wood combo.  No doubt a special guitar.  Congrats on the purchase.

      • #438
        Hank
        Participant

        Spdster,
        REALLY wonderful…..Believe me when I say ,I know how you feel.
        Have you taken it out and tilted the back toward the sun ??
        try It…You’ll like it.
        I tend to play a bit more quietly on my OM than on my other guitars. Don’t know why …mayb the “Spirit” of The Tree ?


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #468
      wespj10
      Participant

      After seeing Spdster’s OMG and Zorro’s OM with “The Tree”, I had to take the plunge and reserve the new SCGC OM “The Tree” that The Music Emporium has in build.  Attached is the first pic of the back.  It’s early days in the process, but I can’t wait…  Specs will be very similar to the OMG.

    • #489
      tadol
      Moderator

      Yow! very nice stuff! But with all these fancy Tree guitars, don’t you need to find an equally fancy clear backed case to show it off?

       

      😉

    • #493
      58spdstr
      Participant

      wespj10, congratulations!  You won’t be disappointed and it’s exciting to watch a new one come together.  I’ve found that mine has opened up in voice much more quickly than I anticipated.  Probably the result of different characteristics with the Euro spruce than the red spruce that I have more experience with.  The “tree” back and sides seem to produce more overtones than other mahogany guitars that I play regularly and fits in somewhere between rosewood and a more typical mahogany box.  It’s a very intimate guitar overall in spite of the volume and depth of the larger OMG body.  I like it a lot.  Keep us posted as your build progresses.

    • #852
      wespj10
      Participant

      Looks like the new ‘Tree’ build was shipped today!  Should have it in hand within a week or so.  Pics look amazing!

      https://www.santacruzguitar.com/social-feed-blog/

       

      • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by wespj10.
      • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by wespj10.
      • #854
        Hank
        Participant

        Man, that is beautiful….but please post more pix when it is in your possession.
        I know that you will play it with style.


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

      • #871
        Hank
        Participant

        SOOOO???
        has it arrived in HotLanta Yet ??


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #855
      Frozen Rat
      Participant

      One of my Santa Cruz guitars is mahogany-backed. While it’s certainly not from the tree, it too sounds less like mahogany than other guitars made with the same materials. I don’t know if that’s because of the Adirondack top or the way it’s constructed. It has a really warm, deep tone to it. It’s not airy or woody per se. like hog tends to be; it’s more toneful, resonant and deep like a rosewood-backed guitar. If I were to compare it to a rosewood-backed guitar in a blind test (before I ever played it because I know what it sounds like now) I have my doubts that I could pick it out from rosewood-backed guitars. This guitar has a tone that reaches down into your soul.


      Santa Cruz 00 — Goodall 000 — Martin 00-28

      • #856
        Hank
        Participant

        F.R.
        As been said many times on many Forums….it is the BUILDER, more than the materials that produce the final “VOICE” Of The Instrument.
        The great Violins were all built of similar materials. Great guitars use similar woods and bones and steel…..But the origin of the parts is only a small part of the end result.
        AND By The Way….that is why we are rebuilding this Forum….because we are Believers !!!!


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

        • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by Hank.
        • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by Hank.
    • #858
      tadol
      Moderator

      Now I want a Tree SC –    ;-(

      • #859
        Hank
        Participant

        I understand….I want a Flamed Maple FTC 40th Edition.


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

      • #869
        tadol
        Moderator

        those are probably easier to find  –

      • #870
        Matt Hayden
        Participant

        I’d settle for a plain maple FTC of any vintage 😉

      • #872
        Hank
        Participant

        Yes Matt but your MUCH younger than I am….. When the horizon approaches one gets selfish.
        And Very particular !!


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

        • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by Hank.
        • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by Hank.
    • #874
      Matt Hayden
      Participant

      Not that much younger, though I thank you for thinking I am. 😉

      I’m just at the point where a carved back FTC from Tree mahogany would be superfluous in the places I play, so I go with a simpler option.  And the first FTC I ever played was dead plain maple (Neil at Los Gatos Guitar Gallery), and it’s why I love SCGC instruments….omg that was good, and the owner had decided not to sell it.

    • #877
      tadol
      Moderator

      Gorgeous FTC at the Music Emporium, but its got that durn 1-11/16” nut –

      I am dreaming about a rosewood FTC, and that just might become a reality in my lifetime – but I’m trying to not get my hopes up too high – yet – this should probably be a different thread –

    • #887
      wespj10
      Participant

      Sorry for the long delay on this.  My guitar arrived on Thursday and it is fantastic in every way.  Lighter than nearly every SC I’ve owned so far (around 10) and extremely resonant with a beautiful voice.  Below are a few pics taken by the guys at TME.  There’s no way I can take a better pic, so I figured these would work well…

       

      • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by wespj10.
      • This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by wespj10.
      • #891
        Hank
        Participant

        Beautiful…I’m kind of surprised you’ve taken time from playing it to post the pictures.
        I would say THAT’S A KEEPER !!!


        1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
        2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
        2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
        2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
        2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
        2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
        2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
        Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
        The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #889
      wespj10
      Participant

      Front

    • #890
      haasome
      Participant

      That sure is beautiful. I can imagine how nice it sounds & plays. Enjoy.


      – Paul –

    • #898
      tadol
      Moderator

      Incredible- thats really nice –

    • #2272
      tadol
      Moderator

      I’m kinda resurrecting an old thread here, but I’ve had a chance to play a couple guitars that Bruce Sexauer recently made from the Tree stock, and there is definitely something above and beyond the normal mahogany there – but I still think it takes alot of special attention to bring that into a special instrument. Its clear to me Bruce can do it, and I have to believe that Richard is someone who could as well – gotta get a chance to play a SCGC Tree OM one of these days – preferably sooner than later  –

    • #2308
      Acoustic Soul
      Participant

      Oh, I love the discussion of The Tree.  I was just reading through everything.

      From what I’ve listened to The Tree definitely sounds denser and more wet up top than other mahogany, and the old brazilian stuff sounds less dense and clearer than the rosewood we play today.

      I have an OM Grand with pre war bracing, brazilian appointments, italian moon spruce top, and figured cocobolo back and sides.  I wish we could get them together because I think for strumming the mahogany has to win.

      That’s my only Santa Cruz because I sold my first one to pay the bill for this one.

      I DO WANT TO GET :  Santa Cruz RS   Old Growth Adirondack/Tunnel 13 Redwood and some Tree Mahogany/ high grade …. one of my actual concerns is that I lose enough woodiness and airiness in the sound.. especially that big of a body.  One of the things that I totally am lacking and jonesing for in my OM Grand is a woody midrange and dryness/air in the top end.  It really serves me better as a finger style guitar or light strummer than anything. I really need a main guitar that is funkier , drier, and woodier that can handle medium strings and blue chip picks.

      My concern there also is that in an RS body anything approaching rosewood would start to get rosewood complexity and overlap too much with the guitar I already have.

       

      I haven’t asked the shop too much about the woods though until it’s time for me to put some money down because they’re so busy they don’t have the time (to be fair who really does?).  When I get ready to order is when I want to decide which mahogany and adirondack is going to serve me best.

       

      But that aside, what do you guys think the result from a Tunnel 13 redwood top and The Tree would be?  Compared to an old growth adirondack old growth mahogany 1934 quality set?

    • #2309
      Acoustic Soul
      Participant

      Is this the clip to the one you bought? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUQTGbGjQfU

    • #2313
      tadol
      Moderator

      I was gonna say that adding tunnel 13 to the Tree and having it done by Santa Cruz might be like making a dessert with home made brownies and hand churned ice cream and gourmet caramel and special sprinkles – that you can actually get too much of a good thing. But then I saw this video and realized I was full of cr@p –

      Go for it!

      https://youtu.be/5vLPiEWe04I

    • #4522
      al
      Participant

      There are always a particular guitar or two that you have sold.  Only to have seller’s remorse.

      Hank’s OM(G) Tree is one of them.

      but, I digress, Hank’s a good guy.

    • #4538
      tadol
      Moderator

      Second that – but I’ve also had to face what a sick puppy I am, when I wonder if theres any chance I’ll outlive him and have a chance to buy that guitar from Dee –

      Hank-  live long and prosper!  😉

    • #4540
      Hank
      Participant

      Aw Shucks…. Thanks for the nice words Y’all.

      When I sale over the Horizon Dee can do what ever she wants with the guitars………But remember she was an O.R./Trauma Nurse for 30 years and she is tough as nails…….Also she does know what I paid for them…..No,really she does.


      1993 Martin HD-28 IR/Sitka
      2001 SCGC F Cutaway Maple/German
      2008 SCGC OT Madi/Italian
      2015 SCGC OM “The Tree” Hog/ European
      2016 SCGC 1934 D45 Braz/ Adi
      2016 Taylor K62 CE Limited Edition 12 string all Koa
      2019 SCGC FTC Granadillo/Redwood
      Life is a journey…not a guided tour,
      The Bay,The Gulf Stream , The Open Ocean are particular about who they share their secrets with.

    • #4558
      tadol
      Moderator

      Well, I can give you a heads up, and say if I go first, Nancy has no idea what most of my guitars cost me, but she does know how to reach Carolyn!

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